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	<title>Comments on: Wave Ripples through Google I/O</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/</link>
	<description>A member of the Gartner Blog Network</description>
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		<title>By: Jamie Leutze</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-272</link>
		<dc:creator>Jamie Leutze</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Jun 2009 10:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-272</guid>
		<description>3 inaccuraices.
Microsoft Groovy is Groove
MSFT put AJAX on the map, even you cite this in prior research notes over 3 years ago.
@whit Google is not a patient company.   They havea  see waht sticks approach and have killed many products quickly.  Do they learn quickly or do they simple have to constantly cull their stable of products.  But a company that is 10 years old with 99% revenue on one product can hardly be classified as patient.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>3 inaccuraices.<br />
Microsoft Groovy is Groove<br />
MSFT put AJAX on the map, even you cite this in prior research notes over 3 years ago.<br />
@whit Google is not a patient company.   They havea  see waht sticks approach and have killed many products quickly.  Do they learn quickly or do they simple have to constantly cull their stable of products.  But a company that is 10 years old with 99% revenue on one product can hardly be classified as patient.</p>
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		<title>By: clibou</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-265</link>
		<dc:creator>clibou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 20:40:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-265</guid>
		<description>Thanks Ray, Steve Gilmor published a seminal work: 

Google and Microsoft are now at roughly the same place in integrating realtime into the respective architectures.

Steve makes some good points, I think we may have a race between the two vendors who really matter in core IT platform technology. The outcome to shape IT spending for years to come. (Innovation in the Enterprise seems long overdue).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Ray, Steve Gilmor published a seminal work: </p>
<p>Google and Microsoft are now at roughly the same place in integrating realtime into the respective architectures.</p>
<p>Steve makes some good points, I think we may have a race between the two vendors who really matter in core IT platform technology. The outcome to shape IT spending for years to come. (Innovation in the Enterprise seems long overdue).</p>
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		<title>By: Google Wave &#171; Viewpoints for Thailand</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-262</link>
		<dc:creator>Google Wave &#171; Viewpoints for Thailand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:09:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-262</guid>
		<description>[...] บทวิเคราะห์จาก Gartner มีประเด็นที่น่าสนใจ โดยเฉพาะประเด็นที่ว่าโครงการนี้จะเป็น Open Source ได้แรงสักแค่ไหน เพราะงานต่างๆที่เกิดขึ้น จะอยู่ที่ server หนักมาก และใช้ Google Web Toolkit (GWT) อย่างได้ผล จากวิดีโอ เห็นได้ชัดว่าคนหลายๆคน สามารถแก้เอกสารได้พร้อมๆกัน โดยผลการแก้ไข จะปรากฏขึ้นบนจอภาพของทุกๆคน ยิ่งไปกว่านั้น แต่ละคนสามารถ playback เพื่อดูย้อนหลัง/เดินหน้าไปในอดีต ทุกตัวอักษรที่มีการแก้ไข [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] บทวิเคราะห์จาก Gartner มีประเด็นที่น่าสนใจ โดยเฉพาะประเด็นที่ว่าโครงการนี้จะเป็น Open Source ได้แรงสักแค่ไหน เพราะงานต่างๆที่เกิดขึ้น จะอยู่ที่ server หนักมาก และใช้ Google Web Toolkit (GWT) อย่างได้ผล จากวิดีโอ เห็นได้ชัดว่าคนหลายๆคน สามารถแก้เอกสารได้พร้อมๆกัน โดยผลการแก้ไข จะปรากฏขึ้นบนจอภาพของทุกๆคน ยิ่งไปกว่านั้น แต่ละคนสามารถ playback เพื่อดูย้อนหลัง/เดินหน้าไปในอดีต ทุกตัวอักษรที่มีการแก้ไข [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Secret Sauce Behind Google Wave</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-255</link>
		<dc:creator>The Secret Sauce Behind Google Wave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 11:08:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-255</guid>
		<description>[...] &#8592; Wave Ripples through Google I/O [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &larr; Wave Ripples through Google I/O [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Valdes</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-254</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Valdes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 04:40:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-254</guid>
		<description>Clive, thanks for your comment (and for being the first in the thread). I think you correctly identify some drivers that will change deeply-rooted behaviors. This works better on an individual, bottom-up level. It is harder to change institutional behaviors that have been baked into the culture of a company. It does happen, but what is perhaps more common is that a change-resistant organization gets out-competed in the market by newly formed ventures that have no old habits to lose, only new ones to gain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clive, thanks for your comment (and for being the first in the thread). I think you correctly identify some drivers that will change deeply-rooted behaviors. This works better on an individual, bottom-up level. It is harder to change institutional behaviors that have been baked into the culture of a company. It does happen, but what is perhaps more common is that a change-resistant organization gets out-competed in the market by newly formed ventures that have no old habits to lose, only new ones to gain.</p>
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		<title>By: Whit Andrews</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-252</link>
		<dc:creator>Whit Andrews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 02:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-252</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s what it needs; there&#039;s no question. Without that step, it would be meaningless. 

I will also say this: Google is institutionally patient. That&#039;s very, very important here. I think its extreme patience has harmed it in some areas, such as Gmail, where had it gotten out of beta faster and heeded what we were saying about the need for rock-solid resiliency, it would have blocked Microsoft far faster and eliminated that competition early. There&#039;s no competition for Wave right now, and so open sourcing it immediately eliminates and co-opts all competition. What goofball would announce tomorrow that he had thought of a super new replacement for email? Nine, because anyone who&#039;s working on that now is busy fingering through sheaves of open source Wave code and figuring how to do it and leverage Google&#039;s work and heft. 

I&#039;m well-known for disagreeing. I agree with this. I think it&#039;s a cunning and effective strategy for Google to have adopted. I cannot, cannot wait to hear more from the likes of you, who can tell me if it does what it says. To the Slashdots!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s what it needs; there&#8217;s no question. Without that step, it would be meaningless. </p>
<p>I will also say this: Google is institutionally patient. That&#8217;s very, very important here. I think its extreme patience has harmed it in some areas, such as Gmail, where had it gotten out of beta faster and heeded what we were saying about the need for rock-solid resiliency, it would have blocked Microsoft far faster and eliminated that competition early. There&#8217;s no competition for Wave right now, and so open sourcing it immediately eliminates and co-opts all competition. What goofball would announce tomorrow that he had thought of a super new replacement for email? Nine, because anyone who&#8217;s working on that now is busy fingering through sheaves of open source Wave code and figuring how to do it and leverage Google&#8217;s work and heft. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m well-known for disagreeing. I agree with this. I think it&#8217;s a cunning and effective strategy for Google to have adopted. I cannot, cannot wait to hear more from the likes of you, who can tell me if it does what it says. To the Slashdots!</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Valdes</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-251</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Valdes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 02:04:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-251</guid>
		<description>Whit, as you know, the definition of what is simple is highly relative. 

Certainly there is a scenario where this system evolves to orders of magnitude more complex than in its current state, just like the first SMTP server evolved to the complex global network of email that we have today.

I agree the protocol is important, but, I agree with Google that of equal importance are the platform and product aspects. The analogy is to Google Maps, which was a great product, but also became pervasive in part because it was a platform for third-party developers to extend and adapt to a range of scenarios.

Lastly, a key factor behind Wave&#039;s future adoption is that Google is open-sourcing large parts of the system. If this were not the case, I agree with you about the guy in Finland. The license is liberal enough that, in theory, you can download the source from Google and rebrand it and start a competitive service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whit, as you know, the definition of what is simple is highly relative. </p>
<p>Certainly there is a scenario where this system evolves to orders of magnitude more complex than in its current state, just like the first SMTP server evolved to the complex global network of email that we have today.</p>
<p>I agree the protocol is important, but, I agree with Google that of equal importance are the platform and product aspects. The analogy is to Google Maps, which was a great product, but also became pervasive in part because it was a platform for third-party developers to extend and adapt to a range of scenarios.</p>
<p>Lastly, a key factor behind Wave&#8217;s future adoption is that Google is open-sourcing large parts of the system. If this were not the case, I agree with you about the guy in Finland. The license is liberal enough that, in theory, you can download the source from Google and rebrand it and start a competitive service.</p>
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		<title>By: Whit Andrews</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-250</link>
		<dc:creator>Whit Andrews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 01:55:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-250</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not clear on this being absolute, Ray, but after looking at Tim O&#039;s piece, I would say the most important thing is the protocol. Is this a simple system that will give birth to a complex structure, per Gall&#039;s Law? Because if it doesn&#039;t, then the only Wave system will be Google&#039;s and one that some guy cooks up in Finland, and that won&#039;t succeed, full stop. 

Also, it is soon enough to say that this won&#039;t kill email. It won&#039;t kill email. See how easy that was? There are lots of reasons for that, not the least of which is that email is like regular mail -- postal mail -- except that it&#039;s electronic. That makes it handy for lots of formal things. Try taking a wave to a court any time in the next 10 years. &quot;Look, your honor -- the defendant implied the derivative was safe right here, next to the fractally decomposed picture of his dog.&quot; 

Also won&#039;t kill mainframes. OK, sorry. Done that rant. 

Can&#039;t wait to hear more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not clear on this being absolute, Ray, but after looking at Tim O&#8217;s piece, I would say the most important thing is the protocol. Is this a simple system that will give birth to a complex structure, per Gall&#8217;s Law? Because if it doesn&#8217;t, then the only Wave system will be Google&#8217;s and one that some guy cooks up in Finland, and that won&#8217;t succeed, full stop. </p>
<p>Also, it is soon enough to say that this won&#8217;t kill email. It won&#8217;t kill email. See how easy that was? There are lots of reasons for that, not the least of which is that email is like regular mail &#8212; postal mail &#8212; except that it&#8217;s electronic. That makes it handy for lots of formal things. Try taking a wave to a court any time in the next 10 years. &#8220;Look, your honor &#8212; the defendant implied the derivative was safe right here, next to the fractally decomposed picture of his dog.&#8221; </p>
<p>Also won&#8217;t kill mainframes. OK, sorry. Done that rant. </p>
<p>Can&#8217;t wait to hear more.</p>
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		<title>By: clibou</title>
		<link>http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/2009/05/28/wave-ripples-through-google-io/comment-page-1/#comment-249</link>
		<dc:creator>clibou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 00:13:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.gartner.com/ray_valdes/?p=45#comment-249</guid>
		<description>&quot;Enterprises deeply-rooted behavior patterns&quot;  

*Young folks graduating now are the first to grow up with the web. They expect real-time, IM, Facebook.
*Corp IT has poor business alignment, often blocking projects to maintain control. Salesforce CRM, adding iPhone support.
*The cost of commuting, energy, time, parking, triggers telecommuting (business meetings @ Starbucks)
*Vacant commercial real estate
*Mobile working

These changes build up pressures to change deeply-rooted behaviors. Enterprises may look for IT solutions to keep employees happy once the market for employees recovers.

In 5 years time....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Enterprises deeply-rooted behavior patterns&#8221;  </p>
<p>*Young folks graduating now are the first to grow up with the web. They expect real-time, IM, Facebook.<br />
*Corp IT has poor business alignment, often blocking projects to maintain control. Salesforce CRM, adding iPhone support.<br />
*The cost of commuting, energy, time, parking, triggers telecommuting (business meetings @ Starbucks)<br />
*Vacant commercial real estate<br />
*Mobile working</p>
<p>These changes build up pressures to change deeply-rooted behaviors. Enterprises may look for IT solutions to keep employees happy once the market for employees recovers.</p>
<p>In 5 years time&#8230;.</p>
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